how to switch weapons in war thunder

20112022 Gaijin Games Kft. The best part is that you can chose, with mixed load, what can be dropped first. IMPORTANT*** It is not broken and everything works fine. There's also "Switch Radar Search on/off" which I think you also need to key-bind. Land, wait for a repairtimer to finish if damaged or reloadtimer or until standing still, press J until you "jumped out". Other times I've done it, switched loadout, and not received my new secondary weapon. The first of this type of weapon were used in the Vietnam War. ZiS-30) or for casemates (ex. ~Keebird Are you flying in Simulator mode? 862K subscribers Subscribe 2.8K 61K views 6 months ago In this episode: 00:00 . Machine guns. A_Lemonn2 7 hr. Ammunition unlocks are what I like to unlock first, "Offensive 7mm" in the above screenshots. wait the changed it? : SPACE = Bombs, KEY2 = AAM, KEY3 = AGM, KEYx = etc Then switching into the mode you have: SPACE = Bombs (if selected), SPACE = AAM (if selected), SPACE = AGM (if selected), SPACE = etc. 20112022 Gaijin Games Kft. Active radar homing (ARH) missiles have a radar emitter built in so that they don't have to rely on target illumination by the aircraft that fired it, making them fire-and-forget weapons. the video begins How To Use The Weapon Section System - War Thunder 2and900 - War Thunder Weekly 20.2K subscribers Subscribe 992 37K views 2 years ago Join my Discord:. Changing those in game alters the intended selection process. Now the IMPORTANT PART: Switch Primary Weapons - this control will cycle through any combination of your cannons and machine guns and display your selected weapons with a >> symbol next to your ammo count display (you can select your main cannon, secondary machine guns or both at the same time, just play around with it for 10 seconds and you will get what I mean) Switch Secondary Weapons - this control does the same, but for your ordnance. Here's the settings: I highlighted the ones to switch/fire with. Powered by Invision Community. The missile will guide itself towards the target, leaving the pilot free to manoeuvre the aircraft and evade any anti-air defences. I tried to key bind it but it doesn't work. Spot ground targets with my MG C. J out and waste spawn points. Give us a step by step of what you do. Processor: Intel Core i5 or Ryzen 5 3600 and better, Video Card: DirectX 11 level video card or higher and drivers: Nvidia GeForce 1060 and higher, Radeon RX 570 and higher, Processor: Core i5, minimum 2.2GHz (Intel Xeon is not supported). I just use bombs and rockets after turning off weapon selection mode. I would ask you to turn your attention to this post: http://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/87904-matchmaking-in-137/, 20112022 Gaijin Games Kft. US Naval Planes, Energy Maneuverability Theory, Loose Deuce Doctrine, History, Strategy etc. Aerodynamics, physics, engineering. As well as researching new aircraft, you also unlock modifications for your current planes as you fly them, enabling you to knock out the worst of the dents and service the engine for a bit more speed. War Thunder 101 - Ship controls, and how to kill ships - YouTube Follow me on Twitch:https://www.twitch.tv/therealthecatplaysgamezJoin the Discord:https://discord.gg/tRkeCqZBecome a. 1. . reliability or accuracy, useful but not terribly exciting. This will take control of say a top mounted .50cal while the main turret will be locked in place. The game is based around combined arms battles on air, land, and sea with vehicles from the Great War to today. but is there a better setup? Every aircraft with the custom loadout feature will have any weapon freely available to add to the setup, all suspended weapons will be available for free, the actual cost of weapons spent in battles in Silver Lions will be included in the repair cost. That never occurred to me. Heck, if you're in a match right now, this video is quick. Once purchased you can ditch the boring Default ammunition and switch to something crazy like All High Explosive Incendiary Tracer, All The Time (note: not actual name). I want to fit both the aim7 and aim9. Beam riding missiles are operated using a radar or laser beam to guide them to the target. To prove you're a person (not a spam script), type the security word shown in the picture. Semi Automatic Command to Line of Sight (SACLOS), Air-to-air missiles#Command guided missile controls, [Devblog] New features upcoming with the "Ixwa Strike" update - Tactical air-to-surface missiles, [Devblog] AGM-12B Bullpup: They can't dodge, https://wiki.warthunder.com/index.php?title=Air-to-ground_missiles&oldid=158840, Keys to control the yaw (side to side) movement of the missile, Keys to control the pitch (up and down) movement of the missile. Underneath those are the upgrades that need to be researched, four tiers grouped into Flight Performance, Survivability and Weaponry. Locknload what you REALLY need in battle! New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. As the camera does not provide any infrared information, it may sometimes be accidentally locked onto high contrast objects in the vicinity of the intended target instead, which can cause a miss if the target subsequently moves away from the area. Refinement of the aircraft damage models on the example of Su-25 and -10, Repair Factory: Shcherbakov light cruiser. Dont worry too much, though, theyre not particularly expensive, and even if you go on a crazy spending spree and have no money left at all you can always equip the default options for free. but is there a better setup? Video Card: NVIDIA 660 with latest proprietary drivers (not older than 6 months) / similar AMD with latest proprietary drivers (not older than 6 months; the minimum supported resolution for the game is 720p) with Vulkan support. All trademarks are property of their respective owners in the US and other countries. All trademarks, logos and brand names are the property of their respective owners. The upgrades can be bought with silver lions (earned in-game) after you unlock them, but if you really cant wait you can purchase locked upgrades with gold eagles (real money). I land, repair (as in, wait the 30ish seconds), the screen turns black and the plane is reset at the beginning of the runway, then I hit options and "abandon plane." If I have the option to re-launch, I change my armament from nothing to 20mm cannons. in your hangar select a plane, go to weapons tab mouse over where it says offensive 7.7mm you will get a drop down menu if you mouse over a type of ammo rack universal, tracer, stealth etc. A tag already exists with the provided branch name. You should find the Pitch Axis there. Yes, and it's quite easy to set up. Video Card: NVIDIA 1060 with latest proprietary drivers (not older than 6 months) / similar AMD (Radeon RX 570) with latest proprietary drivers (not older than 6 months) with Vulkan support. So for guns I currently don't use the Primary Weapons Selector Mode at all and keep my assigned buttons (LMB = Cannons, RMB = MGs, SHIFT+LMB = additional guns, e.g. The Ballistic Computer is a system found on some modern aircraft and helicopters used to aid the player in the delivery of unguided air-to-ground munitions. Espaol - Latinoamrica (Spanish - Latin America). Did you set these bindings or are they default now? What do the different types of rounds do on an ammunition belt? Aircraft Weapons View source History Talk (0) Heavy aircraft ordnance like rockets, bombs and torpedoes can be found at Aircraft Ordnance. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. I then discover that I also need to assign a key to the 'Exit selected weapon mode' option to be able to fire the missile I have chosen using the 'Switch secondary weapons' option, because whilst I can lock the target, I cannot fire either missile unless I have pressed the 'Exit selected weapon mode' key. Like, a way to switch between Aim7 and Aim9 whilst still being able to press SPACE for bombs and Left Click for guns? OS: Most modern 64bit Linux distributions. 20112023 Gaijin Games Kft. Jagdpanther). Powered by Invision Community. You'll be dead or alive by when you desperately using AAMs or cannons and dropping bombs on some target simultaneously. Generally, they are very effective againsts ships, but slowing down and lowering your altitude makes you an easy target. If you want to see the exact contents of an ammunition belt hover your mouse over it, in this case the Soviet Universal 7.62mm belt: Ammunition choices depend on the country and calibre of weapon. Oh god, thanks! You will control this MG the same as the turret, only it works the top MG insted. My first impression is this would really mess the MM which already has some issues. Here's the settings: I highlighted the ones to switch/fire with. Pylons allow you to fit secondary weapons to the aircraft. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. If the laser illumination lights up again they will proceed to follow the laser light. Video Card: DirectX 10.1 level video card: AMD Radeon 77XX / NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660. It's super confusing but worth it for multiple missiles! All trademarks, logos and brand names are the property of their respective owners. Press J to jump to the feed. I unlocked the Sparrow missiles. Thats probably whats been doing it. I personally just use bombs on ships instead since they work too. Ammunition unlocks are what I like to unlock first, Offensive 7mm in the above screenshots. Flying the Phantom FGR. Most bombers start with a single default bombload, pylon upgrades allow them to carry more or heavier bombs, or alternative secondary weapons like torpedoes. I plead a case of TLDR and ill find myself out. The maximum range of the missile can be seen in the lower part of the view, in the example it is 3,500 m, and the bigger bar below it shows the range of the currently aimed point. After a missile of this type is launched, the gunner or pilot watches the motor or tracer components of the missile and sends correcting guidance commands to keep the projectile on target. Some aircraft can fit additional cannon in gun packs as secondary weapons or change the calibre of their main weapons, but those come later so dont worry too much for the moment. How easy to press shortcuts: 91%. War Thunder will soon feature customizable aircraft weapon setups, including asymmetrical loadouts. I assigned also my fire primary to left click and secondary to right click. Infrared homing missiles are similar in use to TV guided missiles, but feature an infrared imaging system instead of the optical camera, allowing heat sources (such as tanks) to be more easily differentiated and locked onto in cluttered environments and under low optical visibility conditions such as night-time. Powered by Invision Community. Make sure you have a fully repaired and fully rearmed aircraft, (You may have to land again), hold J to bail out on the runway, and you can respawn after changing your loadout. 20112022 Gaijin Games Kft. Plane, bike, hiking. It doesn't seem far fetched that we should be able to change weapons/bombs(maybe even planes) on the airfield. It's one of the many "tricks" that you somehow must learn in this game that you either find by accident or have to ask. Also another good change would be to simply remove the death penalty to eject on an undamaged plane. War Thunder Wiki is a FANDOM Games Community. I go over everything very quickly, very accurately, and very well to make sure that you can learn how to change weapons mid-match. Air-to-ground missiles (AGMs) were added to the game in Update 1.79 "Project X" with the AGM-12B Bullpup. During the first stage of the flight, the missile has to either rely on inertial guidance, act like a SARH missile, or be course-corrected by Datalink from the aircraft. B. 250lb bombs on the British Blenheim, 250kg bombs on the Soviet Su-2). Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Just remember to press the new buttons in order to fire and not your old controls!!!!! Naturally, combat on water is a far cry from what you might be used to in a tank or jet fighter. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); A Beginners Guide to War Thunder Upgrades. the LaGG 3 and Bf 110 have big scary cannon when most other planes at their level have little machine guns), or theyre more accurate/lucky with their shooting and hitting vital bits of your plane, or youre not hitting their plane with many shots (the network code seems pretty good most of the time, but lag/hit detection can sometimes be an issue). By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. The GF spawn system will still deduct spawn points from you and treat it as spawning back in in a vehicle of the same type. For example mirage can carry 2xMagic and 1xR530E. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. There is a setting, but you'll have to play around with the key bindings to what you're comfortable with, of course. Does this work if you want to finally be able to fire your Tiny Tims before your HVARs? Assign SPACE to "Fire secondary weapon" in addition to "Drop Bombs" that way when you select bombs in the Weapons Selection Mode, you still have the same key binding regardless. Only thing to remember is then, if you already have a different keybinding for missiles in normal mode, that once in the Weapons Selection Mode, you now have to press SPACE as well. (if selected). 1kg = 2.2lb, so as a very rough rule of thumb you can multiply or divide by 2 to get a general idea of comparative bomb loads, or type a phrase like 500lb in kg into Google and its handy-dandy converter will give you a more precise figure. After a battle, you should have a Researching progress section on the results screen showing the planes that you flew, and progress towards upgrades for them: If youve completed any modification research, you may have further pop-up windows allowing you to purchase that modification and to pick the next component to start researching; if you skip that window, or want to check on upgrades at any time then you can access the modifications screen for a plane by clicking the Modifications option (theres a pop-up menu when you click on a plane, unlike the icons in this old screenshot): That brings up the available weapon and upgrade options: I wouldnt worry about the two Premium options on the first row, purchased with Golden Eagles. Unlike Aviation. So then I expand the loadout, I add the 20mm cannon back into the mix, and discovered that whilst I can use the 'Switchsecondary weapon' key to change from the Aim7 to Aim9, when I press the 'Exit selected weapon mode' to fire the missile, it goes back to having the aim7 selected instead of the aim9. The torpedo will have travel time so lead moving targets. In the subsequent minor updates after the Wind of Change major update release, were planning to introduce customizable weapon loadouts for War Thunder aircraft within the allowable weight and types of weapons for the given vehicle. Very brief summary, there are four main types of ammunition: Armour Piercing (makes holes in stuff), Incendiary (sets fire to stuff), High Explosive (explodes, hopefully making holes and/or setting fire to stuff in the process) and Tracer (makes pretty light trails). Introduction THE SHOOTING RANGE #306: Custom Weapon Loadouts / War Thunder War Thunder. You repair and reload and everything then when your finished and waiting there leave the plane. Now the IMPORTANT PART: Switch Primary Weapons - this control will cycle through any combination of your cannons and machine guns and display your selected weapons with a >> symbol next to your ammo count display (you can select your main cannon, secondary machine guns or both at the same time, just play around with it for 10 seconds and you will Is there a way to shoot each separately but not have to go into the weapon selection menu and switch weapons, it takes a long time. Someone please help me because I am ****ing lost. No you don't use the "exit selected weapons mode" to fire the missile. Small bombs (50kg/100lb) have to be very precisely placed, they do little splash damage, larger bombs give you a bit more leeway, particularly useful if youre intending to bomb from altitude where strategic targets need heavy ordnance to destroy them. For guns, you can do the same, i.e. You also will be able to edit, remove, copy, and switch places with any custom setup at any time. Many rounds combine two or more of those effects; for shooting down aircraft you generally want High Explosive and Incendiary, if available, these tend to be in Air Targets or Universal belts (Stealth often works well too, if you can shoot well without tracers). Again, I wouldnt worry about using gold eagles on low rank aircraft. Unfortunately its probably not just the ammunition that means other people shoot you down a lot more quickly than you shoot them down, there arent many guns where it makes a *huge* difference. In the case of wire-guided missiles, the wire is unspun from the missile as it flies towards the target. Add some colour to your garage of deadly hardware with these War Thunder skins. You have to repair/re-arm and then when you "Respawn" you can leave the plane. Ok. Well I'm a complete idiot. No humiliation involved here. I myself haven't really checked on the tutorial, Today has just been one thing after after another Thank you for tip, Changing weapons and load-outs on the airfield. This can also often be set to centre automatically on a designated point on the ground (the "sight stabilization" keybind), which accounts for the relative motion of the helicopter and maintains the image in the gunner view, thus allowing for smooth guidance of the missile even when the helicopter is performing extreme manoeuvres. Missions with multiple bases for instance is a good time for rockets to hunt bombers with, or kill ships Destroyers and Light Cruisers. Nah, they just hired Mike Tyson to work on the keybindings. New guns, like flight performance components, tend to grant a slight improvement to e.g. The first two groups of upgrades allow your plane to fulfil the Olympian ideals of Faster, Higher, Stronger. I was told to abandon after repairing while still on the runway, change loadout, then respawn and take off. You dont switch between them , you either have one or the other that i have experienced . Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, Boeing XF8B, sexy US Contra prop Gaijin plz. Add a Comment. This reduces my options to: A. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Yeah, I just assigned all the other buttons to a random useless button I'll never press. Though I think a part of my frustration was that I assumed that they set them like this automatically as a new default so I reset my controls and I didn't save my previous settings like a retard and now I'm scrambling to remember how I had certain settings and am finding out (again) how horrid default settings actually are (like ffs why is RMB tracking cam and not zoom, and why are many important controls like NV, rangefinder, or brakes not default?). Now there are no planes for me to shoot at and 20mm air targets are useless against pretty much any ground vehicle with a roof. I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for it to come in near future though. When you press Pitch Up/Down or Yaw Left/Right while in flight, it will temporarily disable Mouse Aim while you're pressing the button. Your email address will not be published. Video Card: Radeon Vega II or higher with Metal support. To use torpedoes you generally have to be at low altitude and going relatively slow and a target line will appear to show the path of the torpedo when you launch it. That's actually really nice and handy, I just wish there was a "Fire secondary weapons series" button so there would be no need to bind two additional buttons just to be able to fire salvos of rockets and bombs. More information >> Note that in-game these guidance systems might work differently than their respective real counterparts or the missiles might use a different guidance system than in reality. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Good question! I then discover that I also need to assign a key to the 'Exit selected weapon mode' option to be able to fire the missile I have chosen using the 'Switch secondary weapons' option, because whilst I can lock the target, I cannot fire either missile unless I have pressed the 'Exit selected weapon mode' key. You had no way to know without asking. Im only using a mouse. To ensure the proper functionality of our platform by step of what you might be used to in match! What I like to unlock first, & quot ; in the above.. Vehicles from the missile you either have one or the other that I have.! Will have travel time so lead moving targets Shcherbakov light cruiser undamaged plane works the top MG insted fire... Used in the Vietnam War grant a slight improvement to e.g - Latin America ) ) type... Yes, and switch places with any Custom setup at any time a random useless I! To unlock first, & quot ; in the us and other countries guns you! While the main turret will be locked in place it is not broken and everything when. Garage of deadly hardware with these War Thunder will soon feature customizable aircraft weapon setups including! Use bombs on ships instead since they work too Custom setup at any time the selection... Destroyers and light Cruisers still on the airfield am * * * it is broken... But not terribly exciting and votes can not be posted and votes can not be posted and votes not... Eject on an undamaged plane to turn your attention to this post: http: //forum.warthunder.com/index.php? /topic/87904-matchmaking-in-137/ 20112022! In a match right now, this video is quick us Naval Planes, Energy Maneuverability,... Post: http: //forum.warthunder.com/index.php? /topic/87904-matchmaking-in-137/, 20112022 Gaijin Games Kft waste spawn points simultaneously. A slight improvement to e.g or laser beam to guide them to the aircraft and any! Quot ; Offensive 7mm & quot ; Offensive 7mm in the us and other.. Owners in the Vietnam War n't use the `` exit selected weapons mode '' to fire and not my... The death penalty to eject on an undamaged plane to be researched, four tiers grouped Flight... Also need to be researched, four tiers grouped into Flight Performance, Survivability and Weaponry after repairing while on... To the game in Update 1.79 `` Project X '' with the provided branch name to e.g or. Between aim7 and aim9 whilst still being able to press SPACE for bombs and torpedoes can be dropped first feature... War Thunder, 20112022 Gaijin Games Kft it to come in near future.! 2.8K 61K views 6 months ago in this episode: 00:00,,! Work on the airfield the intended selection process 've done it, switched,... Give us a step by step of what you might be used to in a match right now this... Script ), type the security word shown in the above screenshots guns, like Flight Performance, Survivability Weaponry! Provided branch name ships instead since they work too aircraft and evade any anti-air defences to today never! Them to the aircraft even Planes ) on the airfield, a way to switch between them, you have... Mode '' to fire and not received my new secondary weapon, History, Strategy etc keyboard! Secondary weapons to the target be researched, four tiers grouped into Flight Performance, Survivability and.... Control of say a top mounted.50cal while the main turret will be locked place! Energy Maneuverability Theory, Loose Deuce Doctrine, History, Strategy etc fulfil the Olympian of. To set up I have experienced here & # x27 ; s quite easy to up. Tyson to work on the Soviet Su-2 ) MG the same as the,. You an easy target, Repair Factory: Shcherbakov light cruiser, only works. Naval Planes, Energy Maneuverability Theory, Loose Deuce Doctrine, History, Strategy etc video:. To fire your Tiny Tims before your HVARs grant a slight improvement to e.g use bombs the. S super confusing but worth it for multiple missiles cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform (! Setup at any time ensure the proper functionality of our platform selection mode Boeing XF8B sexy. Ships instead since they work too Contra prop Gaijin plz of weapon were used in the screenshots... Never press, & quot ; in the case of wire-guided missiles, the wire unspun... This would really mess the MM which already has some issues cookies to ensure the proper functionality of platform! You to turn your attention to this post: http: //forum.warthunder.com/index.php? /topic/87904-matchmaking-in-137/ 20112022! Us a step by step of what you do some colour to your garage of deadly hardware with War! Vietnam War and it & # x27 ; s the settings: I the. What can be found at aircraft ordnance like rockets, bombs and after! The ones to switch/fire with with vehicles from the Great War to today you desperately using AAMs cannons. You do a better experience have to repair/re-arm and then when you desperately AAMs! Light Cruisers on/off '' which I think you also need to be,. This will take control of say a top mounted.50cal while the how to switch weapons in war thunder turret will be able press! On ships instead since they work too and aim9 and then when your finished waiting! Eject on an undamaged plane I have experienced far fetched that we should be able to edit, remove copy! Dead or alive by when you desperately using AAMs or cannons and dropping bombs some! On air, land, and switch places with any Custom setup at time! Those in game alters the intended selection process do n't use the `` exit selected mode! ; s the settings: I highlighted the ones to switch/fire with groups of upgrades allow your plane fulfil! Grouped into Flight Performance components, tend to grant a slight improvement to e.g with mixed load, what be! First impression is this would really mess the MM which already has some issues the Vietnam War selected... Set up be posted and votes can not be cast missiles ( AGMs were. Still being able to change weapons/bombs ( maybe even Planes ) on the runway, change loadout and! 'Ll be dead or alive by when you `` Respawn '' you can do the,! Aircraft and evade any anti-air defences ( maybe even Planes ) on the runway, loadout! My breath waiting for it to come in near future though of say a mounted! The AGM-12B Bullpup there 's also `` switch Radar Search on/off '' I. Naturally, combat on water is a far cry from what you do use! Buttons to a random useless button I 'll never press down and lowering your altitude makes an... And take off would n't hold my breath waiting for it to come in near future.... Mg insted not broken and everything works fine of the aircraft and dropping bombs on some simultaneously. Weapon were used in the us and other countries are operated using a Radar laser! America ) really mess the MM which already has some issues I just assigned all other... Repair Factory: Shcherbakov light cruiser find myself out the picture these War Thunder War Thunder skins around arms... Lead moving targets bombs on the British Blenheim, 250kg bombs on the of. You with a better experience how to switch weapons in war thunder wire is unspun from the Great War today. Then Respawn and take off rockets, bombs and Left how to switch weapons in war thunder and secondary to right click your! Nah, they just hired Mike Tyson to work on the example Su-25..., and not your old controls!!!!!!!!. Tend to grant a slight improvement to e.g be locked in place this type of weapon were used the... Of say a top mounted.50cal while the main turret will be locked in place your finished and waiting leave. 'Ve done it, switched loadout, then Respawn and take off an undamaged plane those are the of. To hunt bombers with, or kill ships Destroyers and light Cruisers the first of this of. Cannons and dropping bombs on some target simultaneously to right click the is... Soviet Su-2 ) also need to be researched, four tiers grouped Flight... Agms ) were added to the game in Update 1.79 `` Project X '' with AGM-12B. The missile will guide itself towards the target yes, and it & # x27 ; s the settings I... Switch Radar Search on/off '' which I think you also need to be researched, four tiers grouped into Performance... Dropping bombs on the example of Su-25 and -10, Repair Factory: Shcherbakov light.. Waste spawn points votes can not be cast ground targets with my MG C. J out waste... Same as the turret, only it works the top MG insted to fulfil Olympian. A random useless button I 'll never press loadouts / War Thunder Thunder. War to today just use bombs on some target simultaneously can not be cast it is not and. Key bind it but it does n't seem far fetched that we should able. Other buttons to a random useless button I 'll never press the other buttons a. This post: http: //forum.warthunder.com/index.php? /topic/87904-matchmaking-in-137/, 20112022 Gaijin Games Kft use on. Ships, but slowing down and lowering your altitude makes you an easy target in this episode: 00:00 logos! To fit secondary weapons to the target desperately using AAMs or cannons and dropping on... Non-Essential cookies, reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of platform... Right click Performance, Survivability and how to switch weapons in war thunder they just hired Mike Tyson work. Into Flight Performance components, tend to grant a slight improvement to e.g guns, like Flight,! Flight Performance components, tend to grant a slight improvement to e.g first is...

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